I have a constant feeling like you said. Whenever I'm awake, or even asleep. Whenever I come up with ideas. Always. People are so harsh, cold, brutal..it's not even funny. Probably I'm not a good communicator through some web forum. I would rather deal with people face to face, or at least hear them what they say. The forum thing is really not my way of expressing my ideas. I don't know how could people fall to this level. I remember they weren't used to be like this. Something happened. Something terrible happened. People lost their minds. People lost themselves. Whereas they looked with enthusiasm to each other, now they look with hate. With insatiable hunger of repossession. To own what you own. To defeat what you accomplished. To become superior to what you are. But when they get what they want, they become confused. They ask themselves..."We have reached what others strive their whole lives to achieve...what now? What comes next?". They become lost. They become empty. And what they fill their minds with? With the same thing they know the best. The hate, restlessness and constant need to be superior over others. To prove themselves that they indeed worthy of their place. Deep inside their hearts they know they are weak. And try to look tough by constantly victimizing everyone around themselves, taking away their hopes, their futures and their lives. Is that really what we came to this world to do? To constantly prove ourselves to our fellow human beings? Are we really only best when we hurt others? We took their money. We took their dreams. We took their future. And we even took their unborn kids. Their very reason of existence has been wiped out. They have no future. The only purpose they have is the purpose of the strongest of them. There is no curiosity left in these people. They have no connection with who they are. They even don't know who they are. They even can't think of who they are. They refuse to think of what they really want. They refuse to plan what they want. They even can't see that they need others. This is who we become. I am ashamed to live in the world when people are so empty. So twisted inside. There is no peace inside these people. They are in constant battle. They even can't think of anything else other than 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM. They are like lab rats in their cages. They eat, they drink, they shit and they multiply for their master...only then when they allow them to do so. They hate their kids. For them kids are obligation. Or kids are the justification why they should harm everyone else around them, because they think they have to. Perhaps people have gone too far. They have lost their sight for too long. They can't think of where they come. Where they are. And where they go. They only care about living here and now. The only thing that matters, is here and now. There is no tomorrow. And there never was a yesterday. What only matters is now. And now is not culmination of yesterdays and planning of tomorrows. Today is today. Everything happens today and ends today. Every plan, every hope, every joy, every frustration...it all begins and ends today. There is no other day than today. Once today is over, life is over. Tomorrow is not another day. Tomorrow is another life. With another identity, with another plan, with another hope and another another. Once tomorrow ends, everything ends too. When you walk near dead people, you look at them and think, these people used to be alive. They lived their every day, like it was their last and someday it become one of their last. Now they lie there in the ground, and rot. Worms eat them up and worms also think that today is the only day. There is no yesterday, there is no tomorrow. Only today. To live to eat to multiply as long as their masters allow it. Then come people who try to save the world. They hope people will stand up for themselves. They think people will defend themselves. But it turns out that they were wrong too. Nobody stand for themselves. Nobody cares for themselves. Because once today is over, tomorrow will be another day, another identity, another hope. Nothing will come from yesterday, nothing will carry to tomorrow. Whenever something bad happens, forget about it. As if it never really happened. Just turn your head to another direction. And think about good things you could be filling your time with right now. Maybe it would be a chocolate you eating and maybe even favorite one. Perhaps it would be another TV soap that you watch every Friday. Or maybe it would be another friend whom you really don't know other than few beers you drank and never remembered how you end up in the part of the city you have never consciously been or even would willfully come. Life is such a mysterious thing, why would you bother? Look at how many people come and left this life. No matter how much they spend their time on stupid things called life, none of them escaped the death. Whatever you do today, you do it once. Because the day you not spend the way you want, is the day you never spent. It's a loss. Whenever you feel down, just take another beer, turn your TV on your favorite sports channel and just enjoy how hulky men chase the same ball and try to hit it in some direction. It doesn't even matter what they rules of the game are. What matters is how people try to win the game. And feel good about it too. Hey look at this, this team won today. Let's celebrate that. It doesn't matter who they are. Feeling good when someone won is good. And that is all that matters.

Hey why am I even writing this? There is another beer coming. Cheers.

I would rather deal with people face to face, or at least hear them what they say. The forum thing is really not my way of expressing my ideas.

I think this must be typical of ENTJs. One of my ENTJ friends had explained that he much prefers talking on the phone to typing.

But anyways, I feel you. Life is so mysterious and frustrating. I almost don't blame people for living in denial and mundane shallowness. (Oh, I feel so pretentious.) 

Posted By Nadette on 22 Dec 2011 02:58 PM

I would rather deal with people face to face, or at least hear them what they say. The forum thing is really not my way of expressing my ideas.

I think this must be typical of ENTJs. One of my ENTJ friends had explained that he much prefers talking on the phone to typing.

But anyways, I feel you. Life is so mysterious and frustrating. I almost don't blame people for living in denial and mundane shallowness. (Oh, I feel so pretentious.) 

 

Yeah could be an ENTJ thing. Who knows. I've met so many ENTJs who are living mundane life themselves. You would never tell they are ENTJ if you look how they act though. Might be something fishy about this all. I'm good when I listen to people, not much even looking face to face. Listening is very effortless to me. Well I wouldn't blame them either...if there were enough people around me who weren't shallow like the rest of them.

Ever thought of joining a book club?

I have started book clubs before, actually. I think I'm just craving immediate gratification. I want to read, then look up and talk out what I just read with someone who is on the same page with me. The problem with book clubs is that they have to be so structured. It takes the organic joy away from reading sometimes. But, you make a good point. Perhaps I am being irrational. I can go out and look for people who have similar interests and enjoy reading/discussing with me. Auugh, the effort! In any case, I think I was mostly lamenting the fact that I have a hard time sitting still and reading by myself, especially if the book is thought provoking. I'll read a couple paragraphs, then want to jump up and talk about it with someone. This is really annoying, especially when you have a lot of reading to do and you don't know anyone else who is interested. It drives me crazy when I have to just keep reading and I know I am not milking the text for all it's worth.

Also, Entejay, would you agree with me then that professional athletics is an intellectual drain on society?

What book is it Nadette?

I think I know how you feel. There are so many amazing insights one can glean from a brilliant book and you really feel a strong need to share. Immediately. I think it's the flood gates opening up to let Fi out. It's like you've found the conduit (or are the conduit) to something incredibly meaningful and profound. Even if you don't share it, it's there to draw from.

Posted By Nadette on 23 Dec 2011 01:15 PM
Also, Entejay, would you agree with me then that professional athletics is an intellectual drain on society?

 

Sportsmanship is a good thing in a sense that it teaches team work and competetiveness, which I belive is something that everyone should know as soon as they learn walking. But when this competetiveness serve no purpose or serve as a purpose of escaping the reality, then it becomes intellectual drain on society.

What book is it Nadette?

Currently, "Pedagogy of the Oppressed" by Paolo Freire. Gosh, you're eloquent, Caprice. I think you are spot on. Inasmuch as I love reading and learning more and thinking about new ideas, this conflicts with how lonely I get when I read and my need to externally process (sometimes).

Entejay, team work is always good, but competitiveness isn't always good. Anyhow, I concede that sports are not without some positive qualities. Glad to find someone who agrees that they can become a negative drain on society.

Pedagogy of the Oppressed? What that supposed to mean?

It is related to liberation theology. The book basically outlines Freire's theory of educating/liberating oppressed people from oppressors. It can be applied on different scales. For example, the oppressor vs. oppressed relationship could be between a dictator and peasants or it could be between a parent and a child. It is the idea that oppression is dehumanizing for every one involved because it involves the denial of free will. Freire wants everyone to have free will and this involves education being the presentation of problems that both student and teacher work together to solve rather than the deposit of knowledge that the teacher owns into the students. It is hard to explain because it is about classroom teaching, but it is also about liberating third world peoples.

Posted By Nadette on 25 Dec 2011 05:03 PM
It is related to liberation theology. The book basically outlines Freire's theory of educating/liberating oppressed people from oppressors. It can be applied on different scales. For example, the oppressor vs. oppressed relationship could be between a dictator and peasants or it could be between a parent and a child. It is the idea that oppression is dehumanizing for every one involved because it involves the denial of free will. Freire wants everyone to have free will and this involves education being the presentation of problems that both student and teacher work together to solve rather than the deposit of knowledge that the teacher owns into the students. It is hard to explain because it is about classroom teaching, but it is also about liberating third world peoples.

 

I read somewhere an article regarding similar things (opression etc) that I got pissed off again royally. I instantly stopped reading the article and 10 similar others. Then I remembered your book and decided to come ask you what your book possibly could provide new to those people who are like those with Stocholm Syndrome towards their goverments...and you know, I'm pissed so much that I would even able to read your reply about it right now. I'm so pissed off that I could break anything or punch anyone right now. Even break this computer that type on...

 

I think I need to stop reading these things. I feel like I'm loosing my mind after I get pissed off like that. This is not healthy. And it's not because I'm poor or something. I'm not poor. And I still get pissed off like that. I think I'm red blooded. That why I can feel when things go wrong. I think others not. I dont think they have red blood in their veins. Hell, I dont think they are even human beings anymore.

 

God help me not to lose my mind.

Pedagogy of the Oppressed promotes the idea of revolutionary leaders becoming one of the people and engaging in dialogue with the people. If the people are illiterate, teaching them to read is the beginning of the revolution. Getting them to think critically about the causes of their situation is the main point. One is supposed to have faith in the ability of the people to think critically. A leader is needed to begin to help people admit that they are being oppressed and the oppressors are wrong. Freire really emphasizes "praxis" which is the combination of action and reflection. A successful revolution needs both and it needs to be by the people. Entejay, you would love this book and get a lot out of it, I think.

You are just very passionate. This is good, but it can be exhausting. It takes unusual courage to be willing to force your eyes open and look at reality unflinchingly. It is way easier to just let things be the way they are and accept that someone else is in control. Anger can be good too. It can give you focus and motivation and drive, but it can also be your undoing. Don't become destructive.

It is interesting that you joined the forum when you did. A lot of the things that you are thinking about are things that I have begun to think about too. I want to learn more about economics, socialism, communism, anarchy, libertarianism, revolution, and liberation. I've become disgusted with my country and especially the way we abuse our military. It frustrates me that there is so much suffering in the world and even in my own wealthy nation. It frustrates me that "good guys" always just end up being the "bad guys" with better press. It makes me question my understanding of all history and definitely all politics. It makes me feel completely useless and simultaneously responsible. This is depressing. I'm also frustrated that so many people are content to not think critically and live in ignorance, but I understand too, because I often make the choice to live effortlessly too.

I think part of the problem with my having trouble reading has to do with the fact that I'm reading this particular book. It makes me think so hard. But mostly, it just makes me aware of how very much more I need to learn. It makes me question whether I should bother trying to make any difference at all. Perhaps your situation is a lot different than mine. I would like to work on education policy in the US so that minorities and those of low socio-economic status might have better quality of life. Or, perhaps I could just add to the field of educational philosophy. It sounds like you might want to actually start a revolution or at least instigate some kind of major system overhaul. This all kind of relates to my question of what you want and what your goals are. It is great that you want to take responsibility and make changes and stuff, but you need some kind of goal or vision and also some way to let yourself rest. You are just one human being. I have no doubt that you are capable of great accomplishment, but don't let yourself get overwhelmed and then burnt out.

I might have more to say, but I'm being distracted and don't want to lose what I've written.

If I may be so forward as to recommend to you Nadette and Entejay the following book: Discourse of Voluntary Servitude, by Etienne de la Boetie.

Posted By Stripes on 27 Dec 2011 11:12 AM
If I may be so forward as to recommend to you Nadette and Entejay the following book: Discourse of Voluntary Servitude, by Etienne de la Boetie.

 

What is it about?

Care to summarize?

Well I gave you the book on a silver platter. If you want to read it you can if you don't want to, then you don't have to.

So no need for me to summarize