I am asking because i REALLY don't like not being able to plan forward. For example, if you cannot be sure about something, you cannot plan, so i try to make everything clear so that i CAN plan. I cannot act without a plan. Sometimes it seems that i am acting without a plan, but i am just making up a plan as i go - or i have a plan until a certain point, at which i have two or more plans from which i choose...

I don't like jumping into water if i don't know if the water is going to be cold, hot or whatever. If i totally have to, then i jump into the water imagining it is just right (i will know for sure in a short moment), but i really prefer knowing at least something about the water before i jump. For example, if it is really water down there. 

I can be spontanous... but what one sees as spontaneous is just me spontaneously forming a plan, which i then execute exactly as i planned. I don't like going off from the plan. I'd rather change the environment so that i stay on path than change the plan. I don't get late anymore because my plan entails getting to where i want to go as fast as possible, because if i am there before time, i can always fill up that time with something useful or fun.

I had an argument with my dad and the foundation was that i could not work in the living room, so i went to the kitchen. Then the kitchen needed to be cleaned and i was to go to my own room. Where there is not really much space. Then i asked: Am i allowed to work in the living room? He said: Yes, but when X,Y,Z, then not. So i said: Well if i am not allowed to work in the living room at all times, then i can never be sure if i am going to be allowed in the living room, and because of that i cannot plan when to work and when not, and that means i cannot work in the living room and have to use my own room. But i need more room in my own room, and as you clearly see (I pointed at my table which i had loaded full to prove the point), there is no room. So why can't i work in the living room? - But you can, only if X,Y,Z, you cannot. - But i can never be sure, and if cannot be sure, i cannot plan.... I think we totally did not get each other.

I'd like to know if someone has made similar experiences or thinks similarily about plans.

Oh, and by the way... i don't like it if people make past tense errors in English. I mean, really glaring ones like pronouncing the read from the past tense like the read from the present tense. One time i actually corrected the peron without thinking. Or if they mix up tenses without intending something with that. (For example the "Where there is not really much space" in my own writing is intended to show that it is a "truth". It was this way, and it still is this way. It just is. I don't really think about that anymore, but if i switch tenses from the simple past to the simple present it is to show that it is a "truth".) Or using the conjunctive in a wrong way.

The words are not that much of a problem... but i really don't like past tense errors. (Actually i think word errors are not that bad, but grammatical errors just make everything so hard to understand! It could also change the meaning of the whole sentense...)

Now that was totally unrelated lol. 

I have a question. Would you say that you outline different forks in the road ahead of you? Sort of like a decision tree made up of lots of ifs? When I talk to my girlfriend about plans she comes up with all kinds of possible scenarios, with the motto, always be prepared. While I other hand only have the goal in mind, and the only fork in the road that matters is the very next one. Everything else that has a lower probability of occurring gets eliminated from the plan.

Uff, that's a hard question. Actually, I try to eliminate every fork on the road as soon as possible by getting more information. If there is nothing to be known beforehand, i just postpone the decision until the time comes and then i will do what feels right at that time.

Being prepared... well yeah i guess you could say that. For example, i try to get early to class. A LOT can happen while you go to class... so i plan in a few extra minutes, in case something happens. (In my case... there is a train i have to catch - and they only go once every hour - and you never know just how long you have to wait to cross a certain street because all the cars, traffic lights, etc...).
I try to be prepared for the general stuff, not the specific things. Because there are so many things that could happen and if i have to be prepared to all of them i would never actually do something.

I call myself a totalist. With that i mean i either do something with 100% motivation (totally) or 0% (totally not) motivation. Ok maybe not that extreme, but most of the time it comes to 80%+ motivation and 20% motivation...

...But a decision tree made up of lots of ifs? No! (WAH! HELP! HOW AM I GOING TO KEEP ALL THIS IN MY MIND????) As i said i try to eliminate those ifs as soon as i can. And if i can't eliminate them, then i just proceed until the next fork and then just do what feels right at that time - i rely on intuition to make the decision.

Relax, man. No one expects you to be superhuman.

Thank you. I needed to hear that. I am often far to perfectionistic for my own good. And often i forget that.

Muhuhahaha... my preparation has again saved me... i thought, because today i was the day of an exam, that i should go one hour early to university (you never know what happens, and i normally only barely make it into the lecture). As it turns out, buses and trains were late today and i would not have gotten my second train (i need to change trains)... and then i would not have gotten to the exam in time. So i was able to switch to another train today (because the first train was late so i could not get the second one)... and i made it 20 minutes early WITH going to the bakery before... Hehe...

I like leaving early. I can take in the scenery, meet people, and not feel rushed when I arrive. Bakery, yum!

Jan,

It seems like you are doing what you do not what to do. I don't expect you to even finish it. Leave alone plan on it.

I like having free time... that is why i do stuff 100% at one go, as good as possible, then forget it. (Really, after i do stuff, it just gets erased from my brain lol ) After that there is enough time. If i do things 50% now and 50% later, i have to pick up stuff TWO times (and i have to convince myself TWO times to do what i have to do). And this way i loose too much time. Also, i like coming early... because then there is no stress. I don't like stress.

But we have exam time, things have to be done. In the previous years i was a bit sloppy with university, so i am catching up now, doing a little more than i have to.

In two days the first three exams will be over. After that it gets a lot less stressful. (I have Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday)

 

... or do you mean i should plan less? May be a good idea.

Posted By neocron on 04 Feb 2012 10:28 AM
I have a question. Would you say that you outline different forks in the road ahead of you? Sort of like a decision tree made up of lots of ifs? When I talk to my girlfriend about plans she comes up with all kinds of possible scenarios, with the motto, always be prepared. While I other hand only have the goal in mind, and the only fork in the road that matters is the very next one. Everything else that has a lower probability of occurring gets eliminated from the plan.

OMG....you just completely described me in an analogy. I joke that I could write those worst-case-scenario books, because I see every possible outcome and try to plan accordingly....for all outcomes 

@Jan, I plan (or try to plan) everything. For several reasons.

1) Because I am terribly forgetful so if I don't plan and schedule I'm bound to screw something up and not be where I need to be at a certain time -- granted, I still rarely make it to appointments on time, but not because I didn't try, because I get caught up by [shiny objects] that distract me!!! 

2) Because I have a fear of being alone when I need that social fix, so I almost obsessively try to plan and organize social gatherings and get-togethers with my friends - since we all know the worst thing in the world is being alone on a Saturday night!! Usually it works - especially if I do the standard mass texting to everyone "hey what are you up to today/tonight??!", and I'm bound to get a taker or two. Sometimes it doesn't and then I get irritable....usually when I'm heading towards or in a depressive state...because I so desperately want to escape that loneliness.


I like being spontaneous, it feels natural. But I think my anxiety makes it hard to do so. I had a disagreement with the ENTP guy I am [sort of] seeing, and I was trying to plan for when he is coming to visit me in a couple weeks....much of our disagreement stemmed from the "sort of" above (long story....). But anyways, he got all irritated that I was trying to plan and said let's not try to plan anything too far in advance and we'll figure it out as we go. The great thing is, he fosters that spontaneity in me and leads me to be more true to myself.

 

I relate so much to Lindz and Jan! Neocron, yes. I feel like I am usually all or nothing with planning. Sometimes I carefully plan everything, but this is exhausting. My MO is double booking my schedule and then stressing about who I let down or what I sacrifice. Haha, Jan, I usually leave super early for things too (and bakeries often figure into the picture too!)

I have to say, I like hanging out with organized friends that I can trust. My ENTJ friend and I did first night in our city together. I didn't have to think or plan any of it. She commandeered the entire thing. Sometimes this might bug me because I like to be in charge too, but I actually loved that I didn't have to worry about anything and knew that she was getting us the biggest bang for our buck possible.

 

I think the super prepared planning mode I get in sometimes is related to stressful situations in the past and not wanting to repeat them. I also has to do with trying to fit as much world exploration and experience into life as possible. Sometimes doing everything I want to do is an intricate puzzle. I love being spontaneous, but sometimes I find I've painted myself into corner with obligations and I just can't be spontaneous. Sometimes using my super-planning abilities is kind of a thrill. (Granted the thrill often involves a nervous breakdown...but whatever. Living life on the edge!) 

 

Planning can also correspond to our social sensibilities too. Like, I have a friend visiting in a couple weeks and I'm kind of freaking out because she hasn't given me definite plans to work with. This wouldn't be a problem (spontaneity is legit fun), but I'm really busy lately and this friend has been known to be a burden as a guest. By trying to get things all planned out in advance, I'm trying to circumvent any unpleasant situations that might arise from not planning. 

I have to say, I like hanging out with organized friends that I can trust. My ENTJ friend and I did first night in our city together. I didn't have to think or plan any of it. She commandeered the entire thing. Sometimes this might bug me because I like to be in charge too, but I actually loved that I didn't have to worry about anything and knew that she was getting us the biggest bang for our buck possible.

Yes i agree completely. I like it if someone else plans too - I really like to hop aboard. I don't want to be the one always planning.

 I do plan some social gatherings too. When i do social gatherings, the best way for me is to let friends invite friends. That has worked best. I mean, i invite a few people and then they invite some others. Recently i began planning and a J friend i have has actually said he could spread the word that something is again happening at my house. ^^ 

 

I think the super prepared planning mode I get in sometimes is related to stressful situations in the past and not wanting to repeat them. I also has to do with trying to fit as much world exploration and experience into life as possible. Sometimes doing everything I want to do is an intricate puzzle. I love being spontaneous, but sometimes I find I've painted myself into corner with obligations and I just can't be spontaneous. Sometimes using my super-planning abilities is kind of a thrill. (Granted the thrill often involves a nervous breakdown...but whatever. Living life on the edge!)

Exactly. I have made some really unfortunate experiences when i wasn't prepared or did not come early (i was really unstructured in the past), so i plan more and am more structured to avoid such occurrences in the future.